Selfish ctb??????

[Defenestration]

People who are suicidal are often portrayed as selfish and cowardly,individuals who think only of themselves and cause suffering to others.
I can certainly understand why that view exists.

But if we look at things from a different angle, perhaps the question deserves to be framed differently.

Is it truly an act of altruism for those who supposedly love someone to force them to keep living at all costs,solely to avoid the pain of losing a loved one?

We must consider the fact that these individuals have been suffering immensely for twenty or thirty years, and that recovery or stabilization is and will remain extremely difficult.
I am not talking about someone with "simple" depression lasting one, two, or five years.

Especially since, very often, the suicidal person has already pushed their limits time and again over decades precisely to avoid hurting those around them. They have held on for a very long time, putting others before their own unbearable pain. But at a certain point, suicidal individuals are not superheroes; inevitably, the cup runs over, no matter how much good will exists.

 

[Defenestration]

Opinions???

 

[Rainy_Cloud]

its selfish of them because some do know i struggle and they are still being assholes . so i doubt it would impact them or make them suffer like i need to

Opinions???

def agree with u

 

[never mind me]

I agree with OP. Besides I think everyone has the right to do with their life as they please. Others may be affected by it, but not as much as the person who decides to ctb is affected as they are willing to give up life just to escape unbearably suffering. The exception of the rule for me are people with small children, in this case I'd say you should put in more effort to stay alive and care for your children at least till they are old enough to get by on their own. But even in that case I can understand it, if someone doesn't manage to stick around long enough for their children to grow up. There are persons who suffer from chronic pain or disabilities that take all joy in life as well as people who have such serious mental disorders that sticking around for years for a child's sake might be asking too much, especially if the person is impaired by their mental illness to an extent that it is difficult or impossible to care for their children.

 

[hdead]

It's only selfish if the other party is selfish enough to value their own grievance over your perceived delivery. If one goes as far to call you out for being selfish, it's likely a projection of their own selfishness.

 

[hughmun9]

Just because your actions cause pain to others and relieve you of your pain doesn't make them selfish. Say you break up with your partner, would anyone accuse you of selfishness for claiming your own right to your time and energy? Even though your partner might be heartbroken and you would be causing them 'harm', no one would. Because we intuitively understand that who we spend time with is our choice. No one is entitled to our attention or presence.

Death is in a way the ultimate 'abandonment' of everyone. But just like you're free to leave the country whenever you want to, you're free to leave planet earth whenever you want to, regardless of who would be in pain as a result of it. Just because it causes them pain, doesn't remove your right to your own bodily autonomy.

The only exception to this in my opinion is if you bring young vulnerable kids into the world. You've got a responsibility regarding them in my opinion. Just like we would hold some contempt for someone for leaving the country and abandoning their kids, I would think CTB-ing would be similar to that. I suppose you could arrange them to be taken care of somehow and still CTB, but you do have a responsibility for their well-being. At least while they're young and vulnerable.

 

[Defenestration]

Ce n'est pas parce que vos actions blessent autrui et vous soulagent de votre propre souffrance qu'elles sont égoïstes. Imaginez que vous rompiez avec votre partenaire : quelqu'un vous accuserait-il d'égoïsme pour avoir revendiqué votre droit à votre temps et à votre énergie ? Même si votre partenaire avait le cœur brisé et que vous lui causiez du tort, personne ne le ferait. Car nous comprenons intuitivement que nous choisissons avec qui nous passons notre temps. Personne n'a droit à notre attention ni à notre présence.

La mort est en quelque sorte l'ultime « abandon » de tous. Mais tout comme vous êtes libre de quitter votre pays quand vous le souhaitez, vous êtes libre de quitter la planète Terre quand vous le souhaitez, sans vous soucier de la souffrance que cela pourrait engendrer. Le fait que cela cause de la douleur à autrui ne vous prive pas de votre droit à l'autonomie corporelle.

La seule exception à cette règle, à mon avis, concerne la mise au monde d'enfants jeunes et vulnérables. Vous avez une responsabilité envers eux. De la même manière qu'on éprouverait du mépris pour quelqu'un qui quitte son pays en abandonnant ses enfants, je pense que l'abandon d'enfants serait similaire. On pourrait sans doute s'arranger pour qu'ils soient pris en charge et rester dans cette situation, mais on a néanmoins une responsabilité quant à leur bien-être, du moins tant qu'ils sont jeunes et vulnérables.

 

[Passenger4224]

When someone called a suicidal person selfish, it comes from feelings of entitlement. No, it is not selfish to CTB, and it is selfish to try to keep someone alive.

 

[dragonofenvy]

I mean, would you want someone to be tortured each day but kept alive just so you won't have to feel the pain of losing them? I know I wouldn't want that. It's others who are selfish.

 

[Forever Sleep]

I think- sadly- it sometimes comes from a lack of understanding. Presumably- they don't find preventing suicide selfish because they genuinely believe that person could recover to live a reasonably happy life. I think the reality of the situation may well have been that the person would have only continued to struggle and suffer but, I'm not sure that they believe that. So- do they actually want the person to live in pain and suffering or, are they holding on to the idea that everyone can recover?

For example- if the same person had an injury that was obvious. They were paralyzed say. And, the doctors confirmed that nothing more could be done to help them. Perhaps in that case- those around them might be more sympathetic because their plight is so obvious.

The problem with mental suffering is that is isn't so easy to guage. It doesn't even seem to be well diagnosed. Plus, we are all pushed to still live a 'normal' life- if we possibly can. Work to support ourselves etc. Mental illness, depression and ideation are all still somewhat taboo so- we learn to hide these things. Sometimes for decades on end. So- a lot of the pain and struggle is hidden from those around us for many people. So- to them- it may indeed be a shock when someone kills themselves.

Ultimately though- I think both actions have selfish elements. If we cause our death early- we inflict grief earlier on the ones we love. When people insist we stay here, they may well be trapping us in painful circumstances.