• ⚠️ UK Access Block Notice: Beginning July 1, 2025, this site will no longer be accessible from the United Kingdom. This is a voluntary decision made by the site's administrators. We were not forced or ordered to implement this block.

F

Forever Sleep

Earned it we have...
May 4, 2022
13,726
I'm refering to the fire and brimstone old testament God here...

But, I find the concept weird. If you do something terrible in this life but you genuinely repent- God will forgive you presumably. But, if you aren't repentent or, you don't beg for forgiveness, what? You get banished to hell forever? What if you feel genuinely repentent in hell? Does God not believe in reform then? At least, not after a person is dead?

I also don't see the value in punishing a person/ soul forever. Asides from some perverse sadistic satisfaction in watching them suffer. Perhaps they deserve to be forced to atone for the hurt they caused. But, forever?

Obviously, we jail the most dangerous criminals for life in this society. Simply I imagine- because it's too risky to release them. They were presumably so dangerous to others that, we can't even risk that they might have reformed. But, God can presumably protect their flock in heaven. So- why the need for an eternal hell?

Personally, I hope there is no God. Certainly no hell but, I don't like the idea of being under the rule of such a being anyway. Their ideas seem peculiar.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Praestat_Mori
Pluto

Pluto

Cat Extremist
Dec 27, 2020
5,943
97629bff786c8002ebac8735a6c4697c.jpg
 
  • Yay!
Reactions: gunmetalblue11 and Forever Sleep
cme-dme

cme-dme

Ready to go to bed
Feb 1, 2025
489
Personally, I believe the idea of eternal damnation was only really there to motivate people to not do bad things. If you think about it for too long it stops making sense. Here's a cool video about the topic:

This video is more about the idea of hell as a whole but it also covers how the concept of eternal damnation is pretty silly when you think about it.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Forever Sleep
Dejected 55

Dejected 55

Enlightened
May 7, 2025
1,960
Forget the concept of doing bad and repenting = good... Consider that according to the bible(s) you can be a good person, do good things all your life, essentially follow all the ideals of the religion... BUT be an atheist or agnostic and don't believe in God... and no matter how good you are, fuck you because you didn't bend the knee for God.

That's pretty shitty.

He'll let in the child molesters and murderers who repent on their deathbed... but not the good soul who committed the unforgivable sin of not being a believer.

Meanwhile... Old Testament God gave no shits at all... one bad person in a town and he'd fucking raze the whole thing just because he could and start over.
 
  • Like
Reactions: gunmetalblue11 and Forever Sleep
I

itsgone2

-
Sep 21, 2025
761
Forget the concept of doing bad and repenting = good... Consider that according to the bible(s) you can be a good person, do good things all your life, essentially follow all the ideals of the religion... BUT be an atheist or agnostic and don't believe in God... and no matter how good you are, fuck you because you didn't bend the knee for God.

That's pretty shitty.

He'll let in the child molesters and murderers who repent on their deathbed... but not the good soul who committed the unforgivable sin of not being a believer.

Meanwhile... Old Testament God gave no shits at all... one bad person in a town and he'd fucking raze the whole thing just because he could and start over.
I agree with a lot of your posts, but this one kind of bummed me out. I get it though. I get the anger. I wish we knew why people that do vile things exist at all. I've made many poor decisions in life, mostly due to anger and not thinking things through, and I wonder why I was made that way. It's frustrating.
But we can't truly know who God forgives. In theory it should be all. Even if so it doesn't help me know. It doesn't help this misery I'm in.
It's frustrating and confusing and I wish I had the guts to end this and just find out already.
 
  • Hugs
Reactions: Dejected 55 and Forever Sleep
asaṅkhata

asaṅkhata

Wizard
Jun 2, 2024
605
Meanwhile... Old Testament God gave no shits at all... one bad person in a town and he'd fucking raze the whole thing just because he could and start over.
The point of sodom and gomorrha was that they were all bad. Lot was the only half decent person there--in god's eyes--that's why he and his family were allowed to escape.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Forever Sleep
F

Forever Sleep

Earned it we have...
May 4, 2022
13,726
Forget the concept of doing bad and repenting = good... Consider that according to the bible(s) you can be a good person, do good things all your life, essentially follow all the ideals of the religion... BUT be an atheist or agnostic and don't believe in God... and no matter how good you are, fuck you because you didn't bend the knee for God.

That's pretty shitty.

He'll let in the child molesters and murderers who repent on their deathbed... but not the good soul who committed the unforgivable sin of not being a believer.

Meanwhile... Old Testament God gave no shits at all... one bad person in a town and he'd fucking raze the whole thing just because he could and start over.

That's definitely something that really gets to me too. I've known some lovely atheists.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Dejected 55
Dejected 55

Dejected 55

Enlightened
May 7, 2025
1,960
The point of sodom and gomorrha was that they were all bad. Lot was the only half decent person there--in god's eyes--that's why he and his family were allowed to escape.
Except... not Lot's wife. She made the apparently unforgivable mistake of looking back as they left... and she was turned to salt. So, God not only thought everyone else was so irredeemable that they had to be wiped out, no questions asked... but someone daring to "defy" him by merely looking back at the place being destroyed was treated just as harshly.

Old Testament God wiped the earth out multiple times over... Noah's Ark is another such story... gives Noah and his family the head's up to save himself and a bunch of animals... then floods the whole place.
 
  • Like
Reactions: cme-dme and Forever Sleep
cme-dme

cme-dme

Ready to go to bed
Feb 1, 2025
489
Except... not Lot's wife. She made the apparently unforgivable mistake of looking back as they left... and she was turned to salt. So, God not only thought everyone else was so irredeemable that they had to be wiped out, no questions asked... but someone daring to "defy" him by merely looking back at the place being destroyed was treated just as harshly.

Old Testament God wiped the earth out multiple times over... Noah's Ark is another such story... gives Noah and his family the head's up to save himself and a bunch of animals... then floods the whole place.
It's crazy to me how comically evil Old Testament God is. Makes me wonder why in the world anyone would wanna worship him (outside of fear, maybe)
 
  • Like
Reactions: Dejected 55 and Forever Sleep
F

Forever Sleep

Earned it we have...
May 4, 2022
13,726
It's crazy to me how comically evil Old Testament God is. Makes me wonder why in the world anyone would wanna worship him (outside of fear, maybe)

I think it must have been fear. I suppose that still makes sense to me now. I can understand fearing the God who created all this. Obviously, some things are incredible too. Anyone who designs rainbows is awesome. But, there's just too much horrible stuff going on (for me) to think about God in a loving way, as a fatherly figure say. Perhaps sort of as a teacher but one of the very worst and most ineffectual types. One obsessed with punishment. One who isn't even fair. I just find it weird I suppose. Like- to feel that warmth and gratitude towards God, I would have to suspend my awareness of reality. Even of religion in places. I can feel awe certainly- if they exist. But more in a kind of terrified/ horrified sense! As in- oh shit- there really is something at the helm of all of this and they're likely very corrupt.
 
  • Love
  • Like
Reactions: Dejected 55 and cme-dme
asaṅkhata

asaṅkhata

Wizard
Jun 2, 2024
605
Except... not Lot's wife. She made the apparently unforgivable mistake of looking back as they left... and she was turned to salt. So, God not only thought everyone else was so irredeemable that they had to be wiped out, no questions asked... but someone daring to "defy" him by merely looking back at the place being destroyed was treated just as harshly.

Old Testament God wiped the earth out multiple times over... Noah's Ark is another such story... gives Noah and his family the head's up to save himself and a bunch of animals... then floods the whole place.
Why are you treating it as though it were real? Yahweh can't hurt you, I promise...
 
  • Like
Reactions: Forever Sleep
F

Forever Sleep

Earned it we have...
May 4, 2022
13,726
Why are you treating it as though it were real? Yahweh can't hurt you, I promise...

I wish I could feel so sure. I do doubt that God exists. I hope they don't in fact but, I'm not 100% sure. May I ask- were you raised to be religious but, managed to reject it?
 
asaṅkhata

asaṅkhata

Wizard
Jun 2, 2024
605
May I ask- were you raised to be religious but, managed to reject it?
I was raised protestant but it never clicked with me. Possibly because I was a social outsider. These kinds of religion always rely on groupthink.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Forever Sleep
Dejected 55

Dejected 55

Enlightened
May 7, 2025
1,960
Why are you treating it as though it were real? Yahweh can't hurt you, I promise...
I don't believe in God... but lots of people do. I believe when you count all the Christian factions, Judaism, and Islam together, there are more people who believe in him than don't... so I recognize I'm in the minority.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Forever Sleep
instormdrains

instormdrains

Member
Oct 29, 2025
29
Forget the concept of doing bad and repenting = good... Consider that according to the bible(s) you can be a good person, do good things all your life, essentially follow all the ideals of the religion... BUT be an atheist or agnostic and don't believe in God... and no matter how good you are, fuck you because you didn't bend the knee for God
this heavily misrepresentes Christianity. There are no good people to send to hell. Chrisitanity teaches that ALL have fallen short of the glory of God both atheist and believer. (Romans 3:10-18 Mark 10:18) if a billionaire gives all of his money to charity after blowing up a building that doesn't erase his evil. He should still be arrested and charged. No matter how much good we try to do our sins can not be erased by our deeds this would not be justice. Christians are saved by grace through faith. (Ephesians 2:1-10) Only because Jesus died for out sins and took our righteous punishment can a Christian be redeemed. This grace is offered to all but the atheist refuses his sacrifice and allows themselves to be judged by their works instead of God's. If Christ came to my house and said sorry bro you've been doing too much and then kills me and sends me to hell that would be an acceptable punishment for all I have done. Any Christian that says they are Moral is a liar.
Meanwhile... Old Testament God gave no shits at all... one bad person in a town and he'd fucking raze the whole thing just because he could and start over.
As mentioned earlier sodom was destroyed because 10 good people couldn't be found not because of 1 bad person (Genesis 18 26-33). They were a horribly sinful city and they even tried to gr@pe God's angels. On the topic of lots wife dying it is because she deserved it. Don't get me wrong she's WAY more moral then sodom it still doesn't make her righteous. In the same way standing next to Ted bundy we are both saints, his degeneracy is no excuse for our depravity. God didnt need to give Lots familly an escape route but he is a God of mercy so he did so anyway. The same way he didnt need to spare Noah from the flood and he didnt need to come down and die for our inequities. If you give someone a bottle of Tylenol and you tell them explicitly if they eat the entire bottle they will die and they read the warnings on the bottle thats their fault. She knew perfectly well that she would die and be judged if she looked back and did it anyway.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Forever Sleep
F

Forever Sleep

Earned it we have...
May 4, 2022
13,726
No matter how much good we try to do our sins can not be erased by our deeds this would not be justice. Christians are saved by grace through faith. (Ephesians 2:1-10) Only because Jesus died for out sins and took our righteous punishment can a Christian be redeemed. This grace is offered to all but the atheist refuses his sacrifice and allows themselves to be judged by their works instead of God's.

This is what I find so disturbing though... Will God truly 'forgive' (supposedly) repentent child molestors, rapists and murderers. Yet, they will condemn a fairly average person with no major sins- simply for not believing? That seems extremely disturbing- and morally off to me.

Why does an omnipotent God require a fan club to begin with- anyway? Imagine if our earthly rulers behaved like that? That it wasn't enough- that we obeyed their rules. That now- they insisted we sang them hymns and prayed to them and offered them thanks. It wasn't enough to just be a good person and a law abiding citizen- we needed to show them devotion as well. Wouldn't an outsider view such a practice as a dictatorship?
 
  • Like
Reactions: Dejected 55 and instormdrains
instormdrains

instormdrains

Member
Oct 29, 2025
29
This is what I find so disturbing though... Will God truly 'forgive' (supposedly) repentent child molestors, rapists and murderers. Yet, they will condemn a fairly average person with no major sins- simply for not believing?
This is interesting and I found it confusing when I was an atheist. Yes this is how it works since we are saved by grace not by works a repentent rapist will be saved. An infamous case of this is Jeffrey Dalmer who gave his life to christ in prison. But who are we to look down on others when we are sinners.

This world is made up of "average people" yet we are still cruel and depraved. Think of all the evil and infighting that goes on around us thats done by average people. We put ourselves on a pedestal away from the freaks and say we are morally perfect but thats not the case

The most logical way I can think about it is like this. Imagine a room of serial rapists and murders. As they talk with each other they won't be grossed out or think each other is sick. Theyll joke about torutue and canibalism and pat each other on the back. They wont see any fault with their actions and might start to admire eachother. Then get a room of more normal murders they'll hear about how gruesome the others are but they won't see how depraved they are. Then more tame criminals like thieves and they'll once again be sick by the murders but won't think its wrong to steal. Then get normal people to look down on all the other criminals as great moral people. But then have God stand over everyone. The Alpha and the Omega First and the Last Begining and the End. Just like murders and thieves we see no fault in our injustice but God is perfectly moral all knowing and all powerful. When Jesus became human he was non stop tempted by the devil and never succumbed. Yet we as normal people stumble more then daily. We are blind to the true weight of our transgressions as we have normalized them in our society.

We are closer to Hitler then to Christ

Revelations 21:17 tells us nothing impure can enter heaven. Heaven is perfect free from sin even us having one sin would tarnish it. The average man does way more then just one sin in his lifetime. The standards are high and our God is a shining example of moral perfection so if we want to be with him it would follow we must be pure which we fail. This is why we need God's grace. The crimes of the average person are so numerous
Why does an omnipotent God require a fan club to begin with- anyway? Imagine if our earthly rulers behaved like that? That it wasn't enough- that we obeyed their rules. That now- they insisted we sang them hymns and prayed to them and offered them thanks. It wasn't enough to just be a good person and a law abiding citizen- we needed to show them devotion as well. Wouldn't an outsider view such a practice as a dictatorship?
To worship a human ruler would be insane because they are flawed like us all. They have no ground to stand because all their own merit they would be dead in their sin.

We should worship Yahweh for 2 reasons

1. We become better people by devoting our selves to him. It is a privilege to get to know a wonderful God. In an interview Jeffrey dalmer said "If a person doesn't think there is a God to be accountable to, then—then what's the point of trying to modify your behaviour to keep it within acceptable ranges?, That's how I thought anyway. I always believed the theory of evolution as truth, that we all just came from the slime. When we, when we died, you know, that was it, there is nothing."
Without making Jesus the center of our lives we would fall victim to the flesh and create our own subjective morality as Jeffrey did. Without God no one can say what is right and wrong because there is no such thing. Everything just is.

Thou shall have no other God's before me is the greatest commandment. It was even more prevalent in ancient Isreal with all the surrounding god's and ideologies. The Cannanites worshiped evil false gods. freaky sex orgies and child sacrifice for the gods were common practice. By having a deep love for God Israel were able to avoid these evils from infecting their society. However there were times in Isreals history where they strayed from God and instead picked up these evil practices. Jeremiah 7:30-31. As our worship for God dwindles we become slaves to sin.

Most of these crazy false god's are thankfully not worshipped anymore but it shows the dangers of idolatry. (You can make an argument that Islam is also very evil but im not gonna get into that right now) As humans we are always chasing a goal if we do not idolize christ other things will get in the way. Even if not towards another god we can worship ourselves, sex, our jobs, or even suicide (lowkey guilty of this lmao). Man can not have 2 masters If God is not our everything we will get lost in the vanity of this life and put virtue on the Backburner. Judges 21:25 this verse is so haunting as it shows without God as king we are free to follow the evils of our hearts.

Think about what God represents. Virtue holiness mercy and most importantly love. 1 John 4:8 in our devout worship we follow his law and become better then if we were to have ourselves as a guide. It is a gift to be able to praise our Lord.

2. He deserves it. Its pretty long already so I don't want to make it longer. He's all perfect and the goat unlike human rulers who are sinful. Its not egotistical to say Usain Bolt is the fastest if he litterally is. He should get the gold medal he deserves and christ should get the worship he is due. God is perfect is everyway. If people can glaze lebron and trump we might as well worship someone actually perfect. He also paid off an eternal debt for us the least we can do is say thanks big bro.

Sorry for making this so long and lmk if anything makes no sense. Ive been depriving myself of sleep to overcome SI soon I also typed this on mobile. 😭😭😭
 
  • Hugs
Reactions: itsgone2

Similar threads

Achromatix
Replies
11
Views
566
Suicide Discussion
OnMyLast Legs
OnMyLast Legs
iamjustapebble
Replies
0
Views
145
Suicide Discussion
iamjustapebble
iamjustapebble
monetpompo
Replies
1
Views
389
Recovery
Mooncry
Mooncry