nitrogen is giving me suffocation response

[n6htzd08cdtfght]

ive had this nitrogen cylinder for a couple of years

https://www.boc.co.nz/shop/en/nz/gases/nitrogen-gas/nitrogen-ultra-high-purity-grade

i tried inhaling from it and it gives me an instant desperate urge to breath actual air, exactly like suffocating and definitely not peaceful. can anyone here explain why, has the gas potentially expired from age? would i get this response from helium?

 

[GlassMoon]

I don't believe Nitrogen can expire. The container is pressurized so no other particles will come in. Also, it does not decompose in any way. I have no clue about which gases cause which reaction in the lungs so I can't help with that.

Edit: If you see an expiry date on the bottle that is likely the date at which it has to be inspected for safety reasons.

 

[Alreadylate]

ive had this nitrogen cylinder for a couple of years

https://www.boc.co.nz/shop/en/nz/gases/nitrogen-gas/nitrogen-ultra-high-purity-grade

i tried inhaling from it and it gives me an instant desperate urge to breath actual air, exactly like suffocating and definitely not peaceful. can anyone here explain why, has the gas potentially expired from age? would i get this response from helium?

it must be that pure? I'm sorry I cannot help you with your question. I bought nitrogen 99.95% pure

 

[n6htzd08cdtfght]

it must be that pure? I'm sorry I cannot help you with your question. I bought nitrogen 99.95% pure

its ultra food grade 99.9%

 

[Forveleth]

That urge to breathe comes from a buildup of carbon dioxide in your system. What is happening to the air you exhale? Does it have a way to escape your mask/bag?

 

[n6htzd08cdtfght]

That urge to breathe comes from a buildup of carbon dioxide in your system. What is happening to the air you exhale? Does it have a way to escape your mask/bag?

thanks for replying. i am testing this for swd method and am breathing directly from a tube connected to the canister and exhaling normally. I have tried this with 2 canisters with the same result. my breathing regularity is normal, except im breathing the nitrogen. within 2 breaths the urge to breath is impossible.

 

[Intoxicated]

my breathing regularity is normal, except im breathing the nitrogen. within 2 breaths the urge to breath is impossible.

Assuming that your story is not fake, you likely got some N2/CO2 mixture with a significant concentration of CO2 instead of nearly pure N2. You can test your gas for CO2 presence using lime water as demonstrated on the video below

 

[n6htzd08cdtfght]

Assuming that your story is not fake, you likely got some N2/CO2 mixture with a significant concentration of CO2 instead of nearly pure N2. You can test your gas for CO2 presence using lime water as demonstrated on the video below

thanks, i will give that a try. my post isn't fake. i am wondering if the suppliers are deliberately adding co2 to prevent it being used this way, but i did pay for 99.9% pure.

 

[Intoxicated]

but i did pay for 99.9% pure.

If you detect CO2 there (particularly using the suggested method), you can request refund or replacement from your supplier. N2/CO2 is a reactive gas mixture that should not be sold as pure N2.

 

[quietwoods]

thanks for replying. i am testing this for swd method and am breathing directly from a tube connected to the canister and exhaling normally. I have tried this with 2 canisters with the same result. my breathing regularity is normal, except im breathing the nitrogen. within 2 breaths the urge to breath is impossible.

That's exactly why. I know you're just testing but this is not how the inert gas method works.

It works by creating an environment where oxygen is completely replaced by an inert gas. If you breathe in ANY oxygen whatsoever your body will produce carbon dioxide and the corresponding suffocation reflex.

Just sticking a tube in your mouth does not stop oxygen from being inhaled. It will still come in around the cracks between the seal of your lips around the tube and through your nose. The only thing it's doing is delaying the suffocation, as you are experiencing.

The exit bag/masks create an environment, if done properly, where oxygen cannot enter.

There's nothing wrong with your nitrogen. You just gotta make a bag or mask.

 

[Dejected 55]

As noted above me... if you're having the suffocation response, you are getting CO2 in your lungs... which can only happen IF you are breathing in some oxygen and exhaling CO2 to re-inhale on a future breath OR there is CO2 already present either in the container of Nitrogen or in the ambient air around you since you aren't breathing in an environment designed to get rid of the CO2.

 

[Alreadylate]

Assuming that your story is not fake, you likely got some N2/CO2 mixture with a significant concentration of CO2 instead of nearly pure N2. You can test your gas for CO2 presence using lime water as demonstrated on the video below

Do you know if Nitrogen TN-28 is appropiate? it seems like high quality

 

[Intoxicated]

It works by creating an environment where oxygen is completely replaced by an inert gas.

Complete replacement is neither necessary nor possible. At the usual atmospheric pressure, quick loss of consciousness commonly occurs when concentration of oxygen in the breathed gas mixture is between 0% and 6%.

If you breathe in ANY oxygen whatsoever your body will produce carbon dioxide and the corresponding suffocation reflex.

Just sticking a tube in your mouth does not stop oxygen from being inhaled. It will still come in around the cracks between the seal of your lips around the tube and through your nose. The only thing it's doing is delaying the suffocation, as you are experiencing.

The feeling of suffocation occurs at elevated CO2 levels. If the OP just exhales into the ambient atmosphere (obviously, you can't breathe out back into the canister with pressurized gas), then there is no any significant CO2 buildup, unless breathing happens at a reduced rate, that shouldn't be the case according to the statement "my breathing regularity is normal".

You just gotta make a bag or mask.

It's surely possible to pass out from inhaling nitrogen through the month from a latex balloon, and this should be possible with breathing in from a tube connected to a canister with pressurized nitrogen as well.

Do you know if Nitrogen TN-28 is appropiate? it seems like high quality

IDK what is TN-28.

 

[Alreadylate]

Complete replacement is neither necessary nor possible. At the usual atmospheric pressure, quick loss of consciousness commonly occurs when concentration of oxygen in the breathed gas mixture is between 0% and 6%.

The feeling of suffocation occurs at elevated CO2 levels. If the OP just exhales into the ambient atmosphere (obviously, you can't breathe out back into the canister with pressurized gas), then there is no any significant CO2 buildup, unless breathing happens at a reduced rate, that shouldn't be the case according to the statement "my breathing regularity is normal".

It's surely possible to pass out from inhaling nitrogen through the month from a latex balloon, and this should be possible with breathing in from a tube connected to a canister with pressurized nitrogen as well.

IDK what is TN-28.

it's high purity gas with more than 99% of nitrogen but not 100%

 

[Dejected 55]

The only references online to Nitrogen TN-28 I could find were in reference to liquid fertilizer... and the TN-28 designation meant it was 28% nitrogen.

So, I'm wondering what the OP actually has that he is trying to breathe.

 

[quietwoods]

Complete replacement is neither necessary nor possible. At the usual atmospheric pressure, quick loss of consciousness commonly occurs when concentration of oxygen in the breathed gas mixture is between 0% and 6%.

The feeling of suffocation occurs at elevated CO2 levels. If the OP just exhales into the ambient atmosphere (obviously, you can't breathe out back into the canister with pressurized gas), then there is no any significant CO2 buildup, unless breathing happens at a reduced rate, that shouldn't be the case according to the statement "my breathing regularity is normal".

It's surely possible to pass out from inhaling nitrogen through the month from a latex balloon, and this should be possible with breathing in from a tube connected to a canister with pressurized nitrogen as well.

Of course there's going to be some trace amounts of oxygen and other atmospheric gases in the bag, I didn't mean literal 100% replacement 0.0000000000000000000000% oxygen.

If we want to get extremely technical, we can go with 'near-complete' replacement of oxygen. That's how this method works, by replacing the oxygen in the exit bag with inert gas and pushing any exhaled CO out the bottom while simultaneously preventing oxygen from coming in the opening.

And yes, I've already described in my post that suffocation is caused by carbon dioxide. It's clear OP is inhaling oxygen in some way and producing carbon dioxide. The only logical conclusion is they are inhaling it from their surrounding environment. It's very difficult to pass out from inhaling an inert gas from a balloon, the most you are going to get is lightheaded.

The cylinder lists "Carbon Dioxide less than 1ppm, H/Cs (as CH4), less than 1ppm, Oxygen less than 2ppm, Moisture less than 2ppm". They've tried this on two separate tanks as well. Don't think this can be the cylinder composition in any way.

 

[Intoxicated]

Of course there's going to be some trace amounts of oxygen and other atmospheric gases in the bag, I didn't mean literal 100% replacement 0.0000000000000000000000% oxygen.

If we want to get extremely technical, we can go with 'near-complete' replacement of oxygen. That's how this method works, by replacing the oxygen in the exit bag with inert gas and pushing any exhaled CO out the bottom while simultaneously preventing oxygen from coming in the opening.

The method works by reducing the blood oxygen saturation level below the threshold when maintaining consciousness (and supporting life in a longer-term perspective) would be possible. Reducing the blood oxygen saturation level is done by reducing the concentration of O2 in the breathed gas mixture. Concentrations below 6% are sufficiently low to make the lungs transfer oxygen backwards from the blood to their internal volume and then out of the body with exhales. The closer the concentration of O2 to 0%, the faster SaO2 in the bloodstream goes beyond the threshold between consciousness and unconsciousness, but technically you can reach unconsciousness (and eventually death) with concentrations of O2 which are as high as 5 - 6%, it would just take noticeably longer than in case of breathing 1% of O2 or less.

And yes, I've already described in my post that suffocation is caused by carbon dioxide. It's clear OP is inhaling oxygen in some way and producing carbon dioxide. The only logical conclusion is they are inhaling it from their surrounding environment.

You need a serious CO2 buildup to start perceiving suffocation. Feeling it after just a couple of breaths is an unordinary thing. I can exhale into an empty balloon and inhale back 5 - 6 times without getting any unusual perceptions. Besides, since the bloodstream and the cells contain some residual oxygen, the rate at which CO2 is produced by the body likely won't substantially change during the first 20 - 30 seconds after inhalation of oxygen-depleted gas mixture has started.

It's very difficult to pass out from inhaling an inert gas from a balloon, the most you are going to get is lightheaded.

If lightheadedness is all you can get, then you're doing it wrongly. Two maximally deep inhales (from full exhale to full inhale) of 99%+ nitrogen performed with 10-15-second interval, followed by breath holding should do the job.

 

[outrider567]

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