Has anyone actually experimented with the EB/IG method?

[Deathinminutes]

Not being cynical. My ctb date is approaching. Just read too many threads w/ supposed experts. Perhaps someone has come across a bit of insight worth sharing? Via attempts of course. I have my nitrogen kit complete. Ive even had several practice runs with everything needed but used a substitute of balloon time He (instead of N2) since I'm aware the He is dosed with O2.

 

[sunny/omori]

this was my method of choice but worries about safety it make me study it a lot. You can read what i learn in the megathread. Just do like I do, read every paper and book published, do your tests and get your own conclusions.

Use at least 20 lpm for 40 minutes. More gas the better. Use aegon or nitrogen, no helium. Use a anchor knot to constrain your arms. Considerate methods more researched before, especially N and chloriquine.

 

[Deathinminutes]

this was my method of choice but worries about safety it make me study it a lot. You can read what i learn in the megathread. Just do like I do, read every paper and book published, do your tests and get your own conclusions.

Use at least 20 lpm for 40 minutes. More gas the better. Use aegon or nitrogen, no helium. Use a anchor knot to constrain your arms. Considerate methods more researched before, especially N and chloriquine.

Hi, thnx for your response! Yeah I've been studying this method since September 2021. A lot to take in. I've read the megathread a few times and studied elsewhere too. @Greenbergs blog & countless websites & articles etc..
I'm curious where you came up with 20lpm? (Have you personally tested the 5lpm variance yourself with your own set up) All through the megathread it says 15lpm. I understand more gas "the better" especially in a larger surface area. But since it's a smaller bag is more needed? Also you said at least, so I'm assuming 25 to 30lpm is suitable in your eyes too? Can you send a link where you read pertaining to the higher lpm?
And yeah, I wish I had N.... So wishing I had some N. Then I could relax but idk how to get it...

 

[Cathy Ames]

@Noctis ?

 

[Deathinminutes]

@Noctis ?

I'm sorry, no.

 

[Cathy Ames]

I'm sorry, no.

Oh. I was trying to tag them because I (apparently mistakenly) thought they had tested an exit bag with Nitrogen. I guess not, then? Sorry.

 

[Deathinminutes]

Oh. I was trying to tag them because I (apparently mistakenly) thought they had tested an exit bag with Nitrogen. I guess not, then? Sorry.

I see. Well, you may have. I appreciate you trying. Hopefully they see it. Is the EB your method too?

 

[Cathy Ames]

I see. Well, you may have. I appreciate you trying. Hopefully they see it. Is the EB your method too?

I think I did the tag correctly, but I'm seeing they haven't been here since April 7. No, for some reason that method seems too risky and technical.

 

[Deathinminutes]

I think I did the tag correctly, but I'm seeing they haven't been here since April 7. No, for some reason that method seems too risky and technical.

Well, I'll certainly give you the technical aspect. Why did you find it too risky? I sort of feel like every method is risky.

 

[sunny/omori]

Hi, thnx for your response! Yeah I've been studying this method since September 2021. A lot to take in. I've read the megathread a few times and studied elsewhere too. @Greenbergs blog & countless websites & articles etc..
I'm curious where you came up with 20lpm? (Have you personally tested the 5lpm variance yourself with your own set up) All through the megathread it says 15lpm. I understand more gas "the better" especially in a larger surface area. But since it's a smaller bag is more needed? Also you said at least, so I'm assuming 25 to 30lpm is suitable in your eyes too? Can you send a link where you read pertaining to the higher lpm?
And yeah, I wish I had N.... So wishing I had some N. Then I could relax but idk how to get it...

It does not have to the with the bag size (use one with at least 40 x 60 cm, as thick as you can get), but with the positive presurre and wash out. 20 lpm is the flow recommended in Final Exit and at least 25 lpm by Ogden (reseaecher of inert gas method and member of WOZZ). All would depend of the max capacity of your equipment, the resistense of your elastic band or cord and how tighly it is closed. I explain this and my test in the megathread.

All methods have risks. Because asphyxation by inert gas it so fast, all would depend how well everything is prepared.

 

[Deathinminutes]

It does not have to the with the bag size (use one with at least 40 x 60 cm, as thick as you can get), but with the positive presurre and wash out. 20 lpm is the flow recommended in Final Exit and at least 25 lpm by Ogden (reseaecher of inert gas method and member of WOZZ). All would depend of the max capacity of your equipment, the resistense con your elastic band or cord and how tighly it is closed. I explain this and my test in the megathread.

All methods have risks. Because asphyxation by inert gas it so fast, all would depend how well everything is prepared.

https://lbib.de/Wege-zu-einem-humanen-selbstbestimmten-Sterben-52551. (English translation option at bottom of page)

1. Is this the book you're referring to by Russel D Ogden from 2008?
2. What does WOZZ stand for?
3. Cual es tu nacionalidad?

Of course all methods have risks. I understand that. However, I'm attempting to trace back to origin statements made on this site. Those in particular relating to lpm/cfh. Do you have any links you can send? A link or two would be very helpful!! And yes, I remember reading your posts, you said you're a MD.

 

[Cathy Ames]

Well, I'll certainly give you the technical aspect. Why did you find it too risky? I sort of feel like every method is risky.

I feel the "ideal" use of this method would include assistance to ensure that the bag stayed on. Looking at how it works, how quickly it starts to work, what can go wrong (especially without assistance), in my mind there is too high of a likelihood of ending up still alive but with brain damage too severe to allow further attempts.

Aside from that, I have the impression it is rather expensive and would require much too much effort from me considering that a) I might not be able to get it working at all and b) even if I did get it working I could fail and end up severely brain damaged. FOR ME, this method would only be usable if I was in a situation where there could be outside assistance in carrying it out, and if I had technical assistance, e.g. if I was able to buy a kit that was pre-assembled by an expert or had the whole thing laid out for me with diagrams, detailed written instructions, and a list of the EXACT (by brand and part number) components that I would need to buy.

TL;DR: the mental calculus factors in my personal physical, mental, energy, and financial capabilities.

 

[Deathinminutes]

I feel the "ideal" use of this method would include assistance to ensure that the bag stayed on. Looking at how it works, how quickly it starts to work, what can go wrong (especially without assistance), in my mind there is too high of a likelihood of ending up still alive but with brain damage too severe to allow further attempts.

Aside from that, I have the impression it is rather expensive and would require much too much effort from me considering that a) I might not be able to get it working at all and b) even if I did get it working I could fail and end up severely brain damaged. FOR ME, this method would only be usable if I was in a situation where there could be outside assistance in carrying it out, and if I had technical assistance, e.g. if I was able to buy a kit that was pre-assembled by an expert or had the whole thing laid out for me with diagrams, detailed written instructions, and a list of the EXACT (by brand and part number) components that I would need to buy.

TL;DR: the mental calculus factors in my personal physical, mental, energy, and financial capabilities.

Hi @Cathy Ames I appreciate your well thought out reply.
I agree with your opening statement. Especially since one has a bag on their head! Lots of moving parts to assess all while looking through plastic and simultaneously attempting to end your life. Assistance would be nice with this particular method.
If no assistance what precise examples do you imagine happening that could go wrong? Do you think you may take the bag off? Not set the flow correctly?
Tech assistance would be great too. But I feel like fumbling through it gave me an understanding of what works and why/how it works.
If someone were to be comfortable working with the EB equipment would you have the same worries for them as you do for yourself?
What is the method you considering for yourself?

 

[sunny/omori]

https://lbib.de/Wege-zu-einem-humanen-selbstbestimmten-Sterben-52551. (English translation option at bottom of page)

1. Is this the book you're referring to by Russel D Ogden from 2008?
2. What does WOZZ stand for?
3. Cual es tu nacionalidad?

Of course all methods have risks. I understand that. However, I'm attempting to trace back to origin statements made on this site. Those in particular relating to lpm/cfh. Do you have any links you can send? A link or two would be very helpful!! And yes, I remember reading your posts, you said you're a MD.

1- It is in this paper. It is very informative on what to expect.

Assisted suicide by oxygen deprivation with helium at a Swiss right-to-die organisation - PubMed

The dying process of oxygen deprivation with helium is potentially quick and appears painless. It also bypasses the prescribing role of physicians, effectively demedicalising assisted suicide. Oxygen deprivation with a face mask is not acceptable because leaks are difficult to control and it may...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

2- It the expert committee thst wrote that book.
3- I prefer not to disclosure that.

I dont see any translation. Must be a chrome option. It seems the latest edition never got translated or at least it was retired.

 

[MICHUNDi]

https://lbib.de/Wege-zu-einem-humanen-selbstbestimmten-Sterben-52551. (English translation option at bottom of page)

1. Is this the book you're referring to by Russel D Ogden from 2008?
2. What does WOZZ stand for?
3. Cual es tu nacionalidad?

Of course all methods have risks. I understand that. However, I'm attempting to trace back to origin statements made on this site. Those in particular relating to lpm/cfh. Do you have any links you can send? A link or two would be very helpful!! And yes, I remember reading your posts, you said you're a MD.

The meaning of WOZZ is Wetenschappelijk Onderzoek naar Zorgvuldige Zelfdoding.

Check belows for confirmation.

1. WOZZ Meaning
2. Informatie over zorgvuldige levensbeëindiging

 

[outrider567]

I feel the "ideal" use of this method would include assistance to ensure that the bag stayed on. Looking at how it works, how quickly it starts to work, what can go wrong (especially without assistance), in my mind there is too high of a likelihood of ending up still alive but with brain damage too severe to allow further attempts.

Aside from that, I have the impression it is rather expensive and would require much too much effort from me considering that a) I might not be able to get it working at all and b) even if I did get it working I could fail and end up severely brain damaged. FOR ME, this method would only be usable if I was in a situation where there could be outside assistance in carrying it out, and if I had technical assistance, e.g. if I was able to buy a kit that was pre-assembled by an expert or had the whole thing laid out for me with diagrams, detailed written instructions, and a list of the EXACT (by brand and part number) components that I would need to buy.

TL;DR: the mental calculus factors in my personal physical, mental, energy, and financial capabilities.

There are no reports of brain damage from failed Nitrogen Gas/Exit Bag incidents as per Greenberg and others on the Mega Thread

Not being cynical. My ctb date is approaching. Just read too many threads w/ supposed experts. Perhaps someone has come across a bit of insight worth sharing? Via attempts of course. I have my nitrogen kit complete. Ive even had several practice runs with everything needed but used a substitute of balloon time He (instead of N2) since I'm aware the He is dosed with O2.

Yes, mine is complete too---3 different flowmeters(MaxDog,a click Flowmeter maxed out at 15 LPM, and two other flowmeters that go up to 30)on hand--huge 3000 Liter Nitrogen tank