can I mask sn death as a non suicidal method?

[Suicideorgy]

for instance, I take my SN. Drink a lot of alcohol, something like everclear and the coroner might think it was a tragic alcohol poisoning. I know it doesnt matter how i die but it would be easier for my family to get over aj accident than a suicide.

 

[Smart No More]

It's not an option I'm afraid. Your blue hue would give it away instantly but even if it didn't the coroner would find out in the post mortem procedure.

 

[Suicidebydeath]

I don't know for sure but I think it's unlikely, you'll just be introducing a random element to your attempt that may make it fail. If they're able to determine that it's SN, then there won't be much doubt it's suicide. As said, you'll have a distinct blue hue anyway, and they'll narrow it down. You could leave a note saying that you'd prefer family to think it was an accident, but it probably won't do much. It sounds like they'll be sad either way.

 

[Suicideorgy]

It's not an option I'm afraid. Your blue hue would give it away instantly but even if it didn't the coroner would find out in the post mortem procedure.

Couldnt the alcohol cause respiratory failure and cause you to go blue anyway?

I dont know how indepth coroners get but if I saw empty alcohol bottles, tested his BAC and it came back very high with no other drugs in the room and no marks indicating a fight would they even bother to check for something like SN?

 

[Ethereal Knight]

no, alcohol doesn't cause cyanosis and doesn't cause people to turn blue.

to stop breathing because of central nervous system depression (which alcohol does cause) is different from having methemoglobinemia (which is, the hemogoblin not being able to carry the oxygem molecule).

also, Stan mentioned in his guide that drinking alcohol during/before taking the SN could increase the chances of vomiting. the body "sees" both alcohol and SN as poisons. you'd probably just stack your chances of vomiting.

 

[Suicidebydeath]

Couldnt the alcohol cause respiratory failure and cause you to go blue anyway?

I dont know how indepth coroners get but if I saw empty alcohol bottles, tested his BAC and it came back very high with no other drugs in the room and no marks indicating a fight would they even bother to check for something like SN?

I think only a coroner might be able to give you the correct answer. They can both cause hypoxia. I think when it comes to suicide it's ok to act in your best interest when it comes to suffering. Death itself causes cyanosis but I think nowhere near to the degree that SN does, when they find you you're not going to look the same as someone who died from alcohol. Alcohol increases vomit chance, which adds to the chance of failure. Also alcohol poisoning can cause some permanent damage if you survive because of taking both.

You can always leave empty alcohol bottles around the house without consuming them within days of an attempt, and write in your note that you wish family to believe it to be death by alcohol poisoning. If nothing else but so you can have peace of mind. My late partner left gifts and notes to her family before she ctb.

 

[Shu]

Nope. They'll be able to detect it.

 

[Ethereal Knight]

They can both cause hypoxia.

I think alcohol's hypoxia is caused by CNS (central nervous system) depression, while SN's hypoxia is caused by methemoglobinemia.

but anyway, OP, I wouldn't worry too much about trying to make it look like an accident. if one's family will heal from grief or not, is something that depends on factors that are beyond one's control. as always, worrying about something we cannot control may not be very helpful.

 

[befree]

No. The only method that I can think of, that could work like this, is nitrogen. Someone would have to remove everything after death, so you would need someone who helps you. But if you are still very young and havn´t had any life-threatening illness so far, your death would cause questions.

 

[lights_are_on]

Seen plenty of stories of whole families dying after eating a meal salted with sodium nitrite. You can Google this. But I don't know how you'd pull that kind of accidental poisoning

 

[Ethereal Knight]

No. The only method that I can think of, that could work like this, is nitrogen. Someone would have to remove everything after death, so you would need someone who helps you. But if you are still very young and havn´t had any life-threatening illness so far, your death would cause questions.

yes, PPH talks about this. page 502 from the April 2022 Edition:

"At first glance, most end-of-life drugs (or oraly-administered substances such as nitrite) leave no obvious identifying signs. Nembutal is a good example. The person will appear to have succumbed to their cancer or heart disease (...)

If an autopsy is performed, the pentobarbital (or any other drug) will be discovered. Questions about its source could be asked.

The only method that leaves no trace, even at autopsy, is the Exit Bad with nitrogen (a hypoxic death with helium will be detectable at autopsy). For the death to be recorded as natural, however, the bag, tubing and the cylinder would need to be removed. This is where a possible breach of the law comes in."

Seen plenty of stories of whole families dying after eating a meal salted with sodium nitrite. You can Google this. But I don't know how you'd pull that kind of accidental poisoning

you mean that they accidentaly mistook SN for regular kitchen salt (NaCl)? or was it murder?

 

[woknows]

for instance, I take my SN. Drink a lot of alcohol, something like everclear and the coroner might think it was a tragic alcohol poisoning. I know it doesnt matter how i die but it would be easier for my family to get over aj accident than a suicide.

No, no, and no. On second thought, in the USA it might be possible, cause coroners do not really need to proper education and probably do not know what they are doing. Butz any other normal country, no, it id not possible.

 

[eve2004]

Benzocaine, the OTC "version" of lidocaine used in hospitals for procedures, has similar properties (can cause methemoglobinemia). I don't suggest anyone actually use benzocaine for this purpose unless you have a bad toothache, but it is widely used for toothaches and stuff so it could be at anyone's bedside...

 

[befree]

yes, PPH talks about this. page 502 from the April 2022 Edition:

The only method that leaves no trace, even at autopsy, is the Exit Bad with nitrogen (a hypoxic death with helium will be detectable at autopsy). For the death to be recorded as natural, however, the bag, tubing and the cylinder would need to be removed. This is where a possible breach of the law comes in."

However, it probably depends on whether and how precisely an autopsy is performed.

https://www.researchgate.net/figure/The-body-of-deceased-with-a-diving-full-face-mask-fixed-on-the-face_fig8_253647263

If everything has been removed and the doctor doesn't come until a few hours later, when all the marks from a mask or bag are gone, there may be no autopsy or no accurate autopsy. If an autopsy as precise as the one in this article is performed, nitrogen could probably be found in the lungs. I know a case where a person helped someone. Hours later the doctor came and certified a natural death.

 

[lights_are_on]

you mean that they accidentaly mistook SN for regular kitchen salt (NaCl)? or was it murder?

Yeah, not murder, just an accident. Only know of one intentional poisoning, there are probably more tho

 

[HopefulButPrepared]

for instance, I take my SN. Drink a lot of alcohol, something like everclear and the coroner might think it was a tragic alcohol poisoning. I know it doesnt matter how i die but it would be easier for my family to get over aj accident than a suicide.

Make it look like you were making ham but you wrote down the instructions wrong

 

[Shu]

No, no, and no. On second thought, in the USA it might be possible, cause coroners do not really need to proper education and probably do not know what they are doing. Butz any other normal country, no, it id not possible.

 

[HopefulButPrepared]

Or put it in a container for the powder you use for acid indigestion, like Andrews indigestion salts, so you became befuddled and mixed it up, and take some drugs so you were all confused - maybe a coroner would be forced to record that as misadventure, can't be 100% sure it was suicide!

 

[locked*n*loaded]

No, no, and no. On second thought, in the USA it might be possible, cause coroners do not really need to proper education and probably do not know what they are doing. Butz any other normal country, no, it id not possible.

WTF? ??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

FYI.........the US IS the country where most of world comes for higher education.

 

[woknows]

WTF? ??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

FYI.........the US IS the country where most of world comes for higher education.

Oh, somebody's feelings got hurt due to living in a country with stupid laws or in this case a lack of regulation? I suppose it is due to the incredible education you get in the USA that you are unable to verify this fact and instead hurt feelings took over?

Coroner Training Requirements

(for the USA)

In most states, elected coroners are not required to be physicians or forensic pathologists. State law often mandates specific death investigation training for coroners. The map below describes the training requirements for coroners.

• States with laws specifying training requirements for coroners: 16
• States that require coroners to be physicians: 4 (Kansas, Louisiana, Minnesota, and Ohio)

In over half of your states, there is no requirement. And in almost all of them, you do not need to be a physician or forensic pathologist.

 

[locked*n*loaded]

Oh, somebody's feelings got hurt due to living in a country with stupid laws or in this case a lack of regulation? I suppose it is due to the incredible education you get in the USA that you are unable to verify this fact and instead hurt feelings took over?

Coroner Training Requirements

(for the USA)

In most states, elected coroners are not required to be physicians or forensic pathologists. State law often mandates specific death investigation training for coroners. The map below describes the training requirements for coroners.

• States with laws specifying training requirements for coroners: 16
• States that require coroners to be physicians: 4 (Kansas, Louisiana, Minnesota, and Ohio)

In over half of your states, there is no requirement. And in almost all of them, you do not need to be a physician or forensic pathologist.

No, you didn't hurt my feelings, merely stating a fact. If I had a loved-one who passed-away under suspicious circumstances, and I had a choice between a US coroner conducting the autopsy, or a coroner from any other country, there's no doubt which I'd choose.

What does the coroner do?
Coroners have the task of identifying the body of the person, notifying their next of kin, and returning the belongings of the body to their next of kin. The coroner also helps determine the cause of death by investigating the death scene, tracking down medical records and interviewing witnesses.

What does a medical examiner do?
Medical examiners, on the other hand, are trained physicians who have board certifications in medicine. The medical examiner may determine the cause of death from a medical standpoint while the coroner will do the legwork of investigating the crime scene to determine why the person died.

 

[Shu]

No, you didn't hurt my feelings, merely stating a fact. If I had a loved-one who passed-away under suspicious circumstances, and I had a choice between a US coroner conducting the autopsy, or a coroner from any other country, there's no doubt which I'd choose.

What does the coroner do?
Coroners have the task of identifying the body of the person, notifying their next of kin, and returning the belongings of the body to their next of kin. The coroner also helps determine the cause of death by investigating the death scene, tracking down medical records and interviewing witnesses.

What does a medical examiner do?
Medical examiners, on the other hand, are trained physicians who have board certifications in medicine. The medical examiner may determine the cause of death from a medical standpoint while the coroner will do the legwork of investigating the crime scene to determine why the person died.

Good Point. Very well.