About "Growth"

[dust-in-the-wind]

Yesterday I posted about 'gratitude' and got some great feedback. Today I ask how you feel about 'growth'? Therapists will say the suffering we experience leads to growth. This one really baffles me because I don't see the point. I am not growing from my major depressive disorder. If anything I am retracting!.
Life is miserable and death is the ultimate endpoint. So how do you validate this "growth" BS unless you are religious? It seems like another platitude to help us sustain our existence. What do you think?

 

[evanescent_eva]

Cancer is a growth, but that doesn't make it good.

 

[dust-in-the-wind]

Cancer is a growth, but that doesn't make it good.

Good one !

 

[Higurashi415]

Yesterday I posted about 'gratitude' and got some great feedback. Today I ask how you feel about 'growth'? Therapists will say the suffering we experience leads to growth. This one really baffles me because I don't see the point. I am not growing from my major depressive disorder. If anything I am retracting!.
Life is miserable and death is the ultimate endpoint. So how do you validate this "growth" BS unless you are religious? It seems like another platitude to help us sustain our existence. What do you think?

The suffering I experienced crippled me without the shadow of a doubt. It also made me the person I am. There could be some good in that, but honestly I can't see it. It feels like I would've been a better version of myself if I suffered less.
If anything, my mental illness is preventing me from becoming who I am

 

[Alexei_Kirillov]

I think there's some truth to what they say, but the dose makes the poison. People genuinely do benefit from some amount of challenge/difficulty/pain in their lives. For example, you grow your muscles by increasing the load you put on them. But the catch here is that if you increase the load too much or too fast, then you'll just end up with strains or a pulled muscle. You could even end up with injuries that never fully heal and that impact you for the rest of your life.

It's the same in life: if you experience too much suffering, far outstripping your current capacity, all it does is break you down, in addition to demolishing your ability to recuperate or build resiliency. Suffering has not made me stronger, but has instead made me absurdly sensitive, weak, and afraid, ready to give up at the drop of a hat, and unable to love.

(NB: everyone has a different threshold of what "too much" is, so what a pro-lifer might think someone "should" be able to handle isn't necessarily a real reflection of what they're actually able to handle).

 

[Gustav Hartmann]

There is body building knowledge transferred to a realm where it does not fit.

What does not kill me, makes me stronger, Nietzsche. So, there is always the risk to be killed.

 

[Forever Sleep]

Personally, yes it's sometimes worked like that for me. In that- from one of the worst and most crushing/ humiliating/ devastating events that happened in my life- I felt utterly adrift for a period but, it eventually set me on a better track. Perhaps, if that hadn't happened, I would have remained blundering along and ultimately (likely) ended up even more miserable.

The likelihood of 'rising from the ashes' is dependent on so many other things though. You need to have faith in a better future for yourself. We can't always see that. Most especially if all our previous efforts have met with disappointment. I don't have that same drive now because I've figured out where a lot of the paths lead- directly in to other quagmires!

We need to view the alternative of not trying to improve our situation as intolerable. Otherwise- we'll likely just tolerate where we are. We know where we are for a start. Trying to break free of that and 'grow' requires vast amounts of energy, effort and risk. Both physical and emotional. So again- the reward needs to seem worth it to motivate us.

I'm not convinced that 'growth' happens unconsciously. Although, I suppose it might. We may be able to look back and see that certain situations promoted growth. Most of the time with me though, it was a conscious effort to either get myself out of a worse situation, save myself from an impending worse situation or, because I really wanted something in life. Enough to subject myself to things I would usually avoid.

On paper though, in many ways- now that I don't have that motivation to keep pushing myself, I've regressed. What's the point of growth if you no longer want to reach the top?

 

[Esc9434]

Hello again OP.

I think growth is all about intellectualizing suffering to stop it from happening again.

I think if we understand why something happened, then we will realize that it was probably out of our control and somewhat make peace with it.

In this context, growth can be measured when you stop yourself from repeating behavior that leads to the same suffering, or stopping someone else from experiencing the same suffering.

Also, I think learning when or when not to have expectations is important too.

In Buddhism, they teach us not to become too attached and know that situations are ever changing, so go with the flow when possible.

 

[cemeteryismyhome]

I'm religious but I think the "growth" thing is a dishonest misuse of the word. Getting punched in the gut over and over and over might lead to new realizations about life and death, and maybe the ability to sympathize and offer support to others experiencing the same thing. But "growth" is a stupid word for that.

 

[Namelesa]

Definitely what @Alexei_Kirillov said

Tho I hate having to grow from this pain I didn't even choose to have. I didn't want any of this nor want to put the effort to overcome it and I just want to avoid it but people forced me to have to deal this and live.

For most of what I have gone through for me the phrase should be "what doesn't kill me, makes me mentally crippled and weak"

 

[FuneralCry]

I could never see anything positive about any of this suffering rather I see all suffering as so undesirable and futile, it's just so insensitive and cruel to me how people insult those who suffer like that, to me existing really is just waiting to die, it's just unnecessary suffering there was never a need for and I could just never see any point to any of this rather I just want to not exist, only non-existence is positive for me, only non-existence can solve everything for me, I'll always see existence as a terrible mistake no matter what, I'll always find it a torturous burden to exist.

 

[seizmic_purple]

I think the underlying assumption of the common phrase or belief about growing from suffering is that every kind of suffering and in every phase of life has the potential to lead to growth. And that is simply not the case. Certain issues can be mild and build resilience, no doubt about it. Even bigger stressors too, for some people (depending on who they are and their resources or life circumstances, to name a few examples). But we can encounter suffering of such an extent that it may not lead to growth at all; it may even make us worse off. And I don't think this is acknowledged. On the contrary, this simplistic view of growth is sometimes used against us or can harm us.

 

[PrismHon]

Well my waistline has certainly grown as I care less and less