Suicide and mental health

[regular john]

Why people believe suicide is always related to mental illness ? Why people believe sane ones don't commit suicides ?

 

[roommate]

It's not usual for people wanting to die.
If you want to commit suicide, there is usually a reason for it, that reason can be related to mental illness.

People might not like me for this but; If you want to get more insights and perhaps get better, it's never to late to ask a doctor.

 

[regular john]

It's not usual for people wanting to die.
If you want to commit suicide, there is usually a reason for it, that reason can be related to mental illness.

People might not like me for this but; If you want to get more insights and perhaps get better, it's never to late to ask a doctor.

I am mentally sane but was given bad genetics that make life impossible for me

 

[roommate]

I am mentally sane but was given bad genetics that make life impossible for me

There are still methods that maybe help you with the struggles you're dealing with.
But obviously don't know what you have tried, but I am wishing you well :)

 

[AnotherSadDay]

The reasoning is that someone attempting to end their own life is one of the most unnatural behavior that a living being can do. Even in nature, some behaviors of some animals are categorized as self-destructive (no suicidal) because scientist think the animal dont have the intention to die.

 

[FuneralCry]

I don't understand that as to me existence itself is the problem and my wish to permanently cease existing is a response to existence, I'd always prefer to not exist than suffer all for the sake of it in this existence where I'm just waiting to die anyway just to be tortured by old age. Ceasing to exist would be my way to find peace from the burden of existence that was completely unnecessary and just caused suffering all for the sake of it and problems there were never a need for. There are no disadvantages to not existing yet there is no limit as to how unbearable the torture and agony of existing can get, for me non-existence truly is all I see as desirable, it's all I see as positive, all I hope for is peace from the torturous and futile burden of existence that always felt like a mistake to me that I never would had wished for in the first place.

 

[Reflection]

Why people believe suicide is always related to mental illness ? Why people believe sane ones don't commit suicides ?

Always blaming it on mental illness is easier than having to look into the the circumstances that might've drove someone to do it, especially when it comes to holding accountability.

 

[DeathSleep]

People want an easy explanation to answer "why" it happened and saying it was a mental illness wraps things up nicely for them.

 

[ShatteredSerenity]

Studies actually do find that around 10% to 60% of people who commit suicide don't have a mental health disorder.

Suicide in individuals with no psychiatric disorders: what makes you vulnerable?

https://academic.oup.com/qjmed/article/117/5/313/7468127#463750782

Most male suicides in U.S. show no link to mental health issues, study reveals

The use of firearms and alcohol consumption are common factors in these deaths, say UCLA and CDC researchers.

newsroom.ucla.edu

There may not be as much research aimed at the cohort without mental illness because it's a heterogeneous group with a variety of factors underlying the suicidal thoughts. For example someone who lost their life savings gambling has a very different profile and needs than someone who has intractable pain from a chronic medical condition. Each group is so small and specialized it's hard to study them, because you need a certain number of volunteers for any medical study.

For the groups who are diagnosed with a mental health disorder there is more incentive and capacity to do research. Funding agencies provide grants for specific mental illnesses, and there are plenty of volunteers for studies who've already been diagnosed. There's also a big need to help these people, for example I have bipolar disorder and the suicide rate is 20% which is among the highest of all disorders. Borderline personality disorder (10% die by suicide) and schizoaffective disorder (13% die by suicide) are also big ones. It makes sense to target those groups because they have suicide rates that are 20-30 times the general population.

 

[areyousafe??]

Depression is a mental illness, the majority of people who commit suicide are depressed.

 

[Rymrgand]

What do you mean with mental illness? Being insane and having a mental illness is not necessarily the same, I think. Depression, for example, is a mental illness.

Even if your reasons to CTB are rational, if your suffering is so severe that you want to do it, then you are physically or mentally ill. Why would a healthy person want to CTB if they are not suffering?

 

[regular john]

I don't understand that as to me existence itself is the problem and my wish to permanently cease existing is a response to existence, I'd always prefer to not exist than suffer all for the sake of it in this existence where I'm just waiting to die anyway just to be tortured by old age. Ceasing to exist would be my way to find peace from the burden of existence that was completely unnecessary and just caused suffering all for the sake of it and problems there were never a need for. There are no disadvantages to not existing yet there is no limit as to how unbearable the torture and agony of existing can get, for me non-existence truly is all I see as desirable, it's all I see as positive, all I hope for is peace from the torturous and futile burden of existence that always felt like a mistake to me that I never would had wished for in the first place.

Well said

 

[FoxSauce]

Could be different factors :
Mental illness
Shortcomings - debt
Home life
Get away from jail or reprocautions find this extremely cowardice)
Guilt


You dont have to be insane to die, ofc relion plays a part and when people say suicide the immediately think mental illness.

 

[lucyanne]

I'm sorry you received advice on getting better instead of understanding and support.

 

[brokeandbroken]

Why people believe suicide is always related to mental illness ? Why people believe sane ones don't commit suicides ?

Because people tend to shy away from things that illustrate the fragility of life. It's a terrifying thing to realize that the amount of events that would need to take place for you to feel the need to CTB is quite small.

It's not usual for people wanting to die.
If you want to commit suicide, there is usually a reason for it, that reason can be related to mental illness.

People might not like me for this but; If you want to get more insights and perhaps get better, it's never to late to ask a doctor.

I'm not sure this is true. In people aged 18-25 13+% had reported serious thoughts of committing suicide in 2023. 22% of high schoolers. 20% of people in general. In 2022 there was 1.6 million suicide attempts. In the US. White males account for roughly 80% of deaths. 60% of those deaths had 0 prior medical conditions.

Between 2016 and 2018 70,000 American men died from suicide 42,000 had no prior mental health history.

In fact even the Yale global health review has stated social and physical environments are important determinants of suicide. For instance social isolation and unemployment are key factors.

You say to get more insights go to a doctor. But as someone who spent in a large portion of my life in the medical field and who actually did go to a doctor for help. It becomes a preposterous notion pretty quickly. I was in medical school, victim of crimes by said medical school, illegally forced out without a career or steps forward. Handling things legally is something I've tried and am trying but is difficult if not impossible. I can provide the story and proof of my claims. Trying to rebuild from scratch is difficult in this situation and slowly appearing to be impossible. But is something i am trying to do. For instance I've applied to 1000+ jobs. I dont have opportunities. I lost my family when i didnt come home a doctor poof gone and I have no friends. So I have 0 social supports or help.

I'm someone highly motivated to succeed clearly I worked my ass off to have it stolen from me.

See i went to the doctor and said this. And it's heres this bottle of pills. But you are not going to find meaning in a bottle of pills. Is it going to make me feel better about being essentially homeless on welfare barely surviving without family or friends? Is it going to put money in my bank account or give me a job? What about a wife is it going to do that? Maybe the reply is maybe it will help you get motivated to do those things.

What happens when you can pull yourself out of bed every single day and do what's necessary and put yourself forward to do find a path to do those things. What happens when that doesn't work. When you apply for jobs, seek out any employment services, workout nearly everyday, study a foreign language, spend my free time learning and etc... What happens when you are trying to improve everyday not destroy yourself. Yet it isn't good enough. Pills aren't going to fix that problem. I'm already doing it? What then?

What happens when your best isnt good enough your life is too destroyed and there isn't a hand to pull you out of the rubble. Explain to me how pills that make you a worse version of yourself if you aren't psychotic are going to help. They won't. So explain to the help a doctor will provide. A doctor isn't going to help you solve your problems. In my experience no one will that hand to pull you out of the rubble of your life someone else came and destroyed well it doesnt exist.

I guess answer for me how am I suppose to tell myself no matter what I do I will never be successful, never have a purpose, never have a wife, never have kids, never have a family, never have friends, never have anyone who cares for me, never truly have a place of my own, spend my nights at best in rooms with roaches and bed bugs. You can say well this is a classic case of catastrophizing but is it? I'm 31. At some point these things become unobtainable. I think it's a lot like a car mirror that date is closer than it appears. Maybe even it has passed me.
Society is okay with people falling through the cracks. When they do most will commit suicide. Just as simple as that.

You may say well thats a rather unique case but is it? Not really. The simple fact is this is rather commonplace. It's borderline generic. Sure the details are maybe unique. But hardships? Pretty common. Lose a job, divorce, medical dx, etc... Men just dont have social supports. 15% of men dont have a single friend. The amount with friends and the amount of friends has decreased in the last 30 years. It probably shouldn't be a surprise suicide rates are increasing. Yet no one cares. In fact men particularly straight white men are actually demonized more than ever.

Studies actually do find that around 10% to 60% of people who commit suicide don't have a mental health disorder.

Suicide in individuals with no psychiatric disorders: what makes you vulnerable?

https://academic.oup.com/qjmed/article/117/5/313/7468127#463750782

Most male suicides in U.S. show no link to mental health issues, study reveals

The use of firearms and alcohol consumption are common factors in these deaths, say UCLA and CDC researchers.

newsroom.ucla.edu

There may not be as much research aimed at the cohort without mental illness because it's a heterogeneous group with a variety of factors underlying the suicidal thoughts. For example someone who lost their life savings gambling has a very different profile and needs than someone who has intractable pain from a chronic medical condition. Each group is so small and specialized it's hard to study them, because you need a certain number of volunteers for any medical study.

For the groups who are diagnosed with a mental health disorder there is more incentive and capacity to do research. Funding agencies provide grants for specific mental illnesses, and there are plenty of volunteers for studies who've already been diagnosed. There's also a big need to help these people, for example I have bipolar disorder and the suicide rate is 20% which is among the highest of all disorders. Borderline personality disorder (10% die by suicide) and schizoaffective disorder (13% die by suicide) are also big ones. It makes sense to target those groups because they have suicide rates that are 20-30 times the general population.

this is true and some of it i even stated. Yet it is also true that research has been on that population. And a lot of it comes down to society see above.

Edit: i also want to say psych wards aren't set up for men in any way shape or form in all honesty. They aren't developed with men in mind. For instance look at the libraries it's romance and true crimes novels. I think in all of the psych wards I went to 1 had a book sports related on lance Armstrong. The only other book even in the ball park was can't hurt me which was given to me with a note on it with the implication it was new telling me to read it.

Honestly in the three American psych wards all had substantial libraries yet none that men as a demographical are going to really want to read. What's the excuse we didn't know you could read?